I have some young friends. They are very nice, but they don't know about anything that happened before the year 2000 in professional sports.
Usually I just let their mindless banter about how much greater person X from 2008 is than person y from before 2007.
Not this time.
A very strong article about the "Redeem" team (USA Basketball 2008) was written on what team is better when comparing them to the Dream Team (USA basketball 1992). To my young friends, this meant (ipso facto) that the new team had to be better. I attached the article below in text format to provide context.
I concede every point made in the article about politics, careers, old men - and introduce some that aren't there about how USA basketball in 1992 had to have at least four white dudes on their team. Racism persists.
Bottom line - the Redeem team is very good - but it is also not the best team USA basketball could have fielded which is the only real criticism of DT1. There are at least five completely underwhelming players on this team - in that they are either a) just great players who could have been replaced by ME and there would have been no change to their chances or b) I don't know why they are on the team when there isn't a legitimate seven footer on the roster to deal with Yao and other behemoth's from around the world.
I will concede that at the bottom end of the roster, Redeem Team is better than dream team. Christian Laetner and Larry Bird (yes, Larry the legend) could have been replaced by better players. At the top end, however, is where the differences really shine through.
Point Guard - Magic/Stockton v. Jason Kidd, D. Williams and/or Chris Paul
The NBA's all time assist leader coming off the bench to sub in for the best natural play maker of all time against three dudes who have only barely cracked the NBA finals. No contest. The Newbies are nice
Shooting Guard A - Jordan, Michael. Conversation Over.
Shooting Guard B - Drexler/Mullins v. Kobe/Wade. I will concede that if Michael Jordan got hit by a bus, Redeem would have an edge here.
Small Forward Offence - I concede that Lebron James will be the best small forward of all time when he is done. So far he has done exactly nothing by "career" standards. He is awesome.
Small Forward Defence - Pippen is a better defender. Who needs offence when you are the FIFTH shot option.
Power Forward - Chris Bosch, Carmello Anthony v. Charles Barkley and Karl Malone.
The best power forward in the history of the game (Malone) is the guy for whom the name "Power forward" was invented. I am sure that at age 45 he could still out muscle Bosch and Anthony.
And the back up is the Round Mound of Rebound? Good luck kids.
Center (and this is where the debate ends) David Robinson and Patrick Ewing v. Howard and whomever else is around...
Sorry, but when Howard is going to be running over to play help defence against Malone, the Center position is going to have a fucking field day with both offensive boards and easy dunks. Howard, who can't legally rent a car in most states, will be outmaneuvered on defence. And that is the weakness of this team- they have no large goon.
And Ewing was a freak of nature, and Robinson was (at the time) the most perfect model of what a solid center was supposed to be. Howard is good, but hasn't proven himself.
Intangible of experience: No contest - Wade and Bryant both won titles on the back of a guy named Shaquille. Without him, neither has done jack.
There is exactly two players on the Dream team who didn't make it to the NBA finals. Yikes. That is clutch.
It is true, the rest of the world got better. It is also true that the Dream Team never really had to try. It is also true, that in a 27 game series, the younger and faster Redeem team might finally draw even.
They are not, in any way, a better team. They have one outstanding player who will stand next to Michael Jordan in history as the greatest. But he isn't Michael Jordan yet.
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BEIJING – With each successive blowout, each complete manhandling of competition exponentially greater than Magic, Michael and Larry could have fathomed, the question about the current USA men’s basketball team isn’t about redemption, it’s about greatness. As in, is this the greatest basketball team ever assembled? Could they even take the original Dream Team?
Immediate reactions of blasphemy aside, the debate is certain to heat up if Team USA continues its blitzkrieg of the Beijing Olympics and wins the gold. The team play has been extraordinary, the defense suffocating and even the outside shooting precise. On top of its game, the 2008 team is a tour de force to behold, its 119-82 annihilation of world champion Spain being the finest indication that this, at the very least, is the best Olympic team since 1992. And that includes a rather dominant 1996 U.S. club.
“They wanted to show everyone they are superior, and they did,” shell-shocked Spanish center Pau Gasol said. 1992
DREAM TEAMNAMEPOS.
Charles BarkleyF6-6250Phoenix Suns
Larry BirdF6-9220Boston Celtics
Clyde DrexlerG6-7222Portland Trail Blazers
Patrick EwingC7-0240New York Knicks
Earvin JohnsonG6-9220Los Angeles Lakers
Michael JordanG6-6198Chicago Bulls
Christian LaettnerF6-11235Duke University
Karl MaloneF6-9256Utah Jazz
Chris MullinF6-7215Golden State Warriors
Scottie PippenG/F6-7210Chicago Bulls
David RobinsonC7-1235San Antonio Spurs
John StocktonG6-1175Utah Jazz
2008 REDEEM TEAM
Carmelo AnthonyF6-8230Denver Nuggets
Carlos BoozerF6-9258Utah Jazz
Chris Bosh F6-10230Toronto Raptors
Kobe BryantG6-6220Los Angeles Lakers
Dwight Howard F-C6-11265Orlando Magic
LeBron JamesF6-8240Cleveland Cavaliers
Jason KiddG6-4210Dallas Mavericks
Chris PaulG6-0170New Orleans Hornets
Tayshaun PrinceF6-9205Detroit Pistons
Michael ReddG6-6215Milwaukee Bucks
Dwayne WadeG6-4212Miami Heat
Deron WilliamsG6-3205Utah Jazz
Superior even to the original squad? Here’s why the argument, first broached by Mike Vaccaro of the New York Post, is at the very least a valid one. The 1992 team didn’t need to bring its “best” team to Barcelona to roll through the Olympics. USA Basketball selected it in part based on personality, marketing and even lifetime achievement. Magic Johnson had been retired for a year. The Larry Bird of ‘92 was long past his prime, six years removed from his final league most valuable player award. John Stockton was chosen over Isiah Thomas because Michael Jordan didn’t want Thomas around. Twelfth-man Christian Laettner, the NCAA player of the year, was selected as a nod to the past days of collegians representing the country.
Those four players averaged the fewest points on the team. Not that any of it mattered. The U.S. outscored opponents by an average of 43.8 points per game and became a phenomenon in the process. In 2008 there is no such luxury, not with the improved play of the rest of the world. The final players on the current U.S. team are Tayshaun Prince and Michael Redd. Prince is a defensive stopper with his pterodactyl-like wing span. Redd is a dead-on outside shooter.
All 12 of the current American players are either in their prime or about to enter it. This team is younger, quicker and certainly more focused, mostly because it needs to be. Comparing results at these games is almost futile. The 1992 team could party the night away in Barcelona, roll out of bed and still win by 40. There have been no reports of such a thing here, where preparation is paramount. “We realize that we made a sacrifice to come out here, and part of it is our bodies need to sleep,” said Carlos Boozer. “This is what we signed up for. Let’s go do whatever it takes to get it. If it takes leaving the arena at one in the morning to get the gold medal, we’ll [do it to] get the gold medal.”
The thing is, had they needed to be, the 1992 team would’ve been just as focused. Jordan would have assured that. If anything tilts the balance forever in the original team’s advantage, it is MJ. In the summer of 1992, he was 29 years old and in the middle of winning six NBA championships and five NBA MVPs, numbers that could’ve been higher had he not chosen to play baseball for a season and a half. He is undeniably not only the greatest player in the history of the game, but arguably its greatest crunch-time player and, along with Bill Russell, the best at simply finding ways to win. If it came down to a final shot, who’s betting against him?
The current team, as talented as it is, would have no logical answer. Kobe Bryant, LeBron James and Dwyane Wade, considered the three best players and outrageously gifted in their own right, are all a step down from MJ. However, the idea of Kobe defending Jordan, his idol, would be intriguing. Conversely, the 1992 team has nothing quite like the physical freak that is the 6-foot-8, 240-pound LeBron. Scottie Pippen on him would be a hellacious matchup, though. As good as the perimeter talent on the 1992 team was – especially Jordan, Pippen, Clyde Drexler and knock-down shooter Chris Mullin – the current squad is deeper and certainly capable of its own fireworks. It is inside where the 1992 team would hold a significant advantage and likely determine the game. The Dream Team’s post combinations were breathtaking – Patrick Ewing and David Robinson at center and Charles Barkley and Karl Malone at power forward, all in their prime.
The current group of Dwight Howard, a tender 21 years old, Chris Bosh and Boozer would be overwhelmed and perhaps systematically fouled out. Carmelo Anthony, an uninterested defender, would have to be counted on here to help. The only way for the current team to win would be to push the ball, score in transition and find a way to prevent the 1992 club from dumping it down low. Could they do it?
The most difficult thing to determine is effort level. The 1992 team didn’t need it. This team is focused almost exclusively on it, especially on the defensive end. “For 40 minutes we (want) to be nonstop movement and chaos,” said Chris Paul. “That’s what we try to do. We wreck havoc. Every time down we’re all over the point guards. Our big men are up, we’re not relaxing.” In a single elimination game, that may or may not be enough.
“You will see a team of professionals in the Olympics again,” 1992 U.S. coach Chuck Daly said at the time, “but I don’t think you’ll see another team quite like this.” If anything, you could argue that while the 1992 version may remain the greatest team ever assembled and one that would be favored in a hypothetical matchup, no team has ever played the game at a higher level than the current U.S. team.
